| dTal | I haven't the faintest clue | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| dTal | I feel crappy all the time | 00:00 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1371158638190940164 | 00:00 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): "First prospective report (preprint) of vaccines helping people with #LongCovid (LC): 44 LC individuals vs 22 matched, unvaccinated controls with 8 months follow-up. A [...] | 00:00 |
| LjL | nixonix, hmm, when i *saw* that table it didn't seem very impressive to me, barely saw a difference, except that the entire symptom profile looked different between the two groups | 00:02 |
| LjL | but i guess that's why one gets actual numbers | 00:02 |
| nixonix | vaccination seems to change the inflammatory cytokine response to stimulus from pathogens. so it could affect to some ongoing infections, that have nothing to do with sars2 | 00:14 |
| nixonix | possibly permanently or long term, suggested in that paper i linked here. but also short term innate immune response might possibly help body to clear it, who knows | 00:15 |
| nixonix | and if vaccine can do that "reprogramming", i suppose different viral infections can do it too. so maybe nothing to worry, more than some people could have bad luck with the change (if confirmed) | 00:16 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.05.03.21256520v1.full | 00:17 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.medrxiv.org: The BNT162b2 mRNA vaccine against SARS-CoV-2 reprograms both adaptive and innate immune responses | medRxiv | 00:17 |
| LjL | so much for no long-term effects | 00:19 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/profshanecrotty/status/1428859549822328832 | 00:23 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Shane Crotty (@profshanecrotty): "Immune memory / protective immunity has a real caloric cost over time. If your immune system sees something once, it doesn't tend to commit much energy into making [...] | 00:23 |
| LjL | <Brainstorm> New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Israel finds COVID-19 vaccine booster significantly lowers infection risk → https://is.gd/AQYlin | 00:37 |
| nixonix | In vaccinated subjects, antibody titers decreased by up to 40% each subsequent month while in convalescents they decreased by less than 5% per month. Six months after BNT162b2 vaccination 16.1% subjects had antibody levels below the seropositivity threshold of <50 AU/mL, while only 10.8% of convalescent patients were below <50 AU/mL threshold after | 00:46 |
| nixonix | 9 months from SARS-CoV-2 infection | 00:46 |
| LjL | i noticed that :\ | 00:46 |
| nixonix | how was it with that chinese vaccine again? it was in that thai article, i think | 00:46 |
| nixonix | after those thai articles there was a chinese article announcing how important chinese vaccines are for thais (in english) | 00:47 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.19.21262111v1 | 00:47 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.medrxiv.org: Large-scale study of antibody titer decay following BNT162b2 mRNA vaccine or SARS-CoV-2 infection | medRxiv | 00:48 |
| LjL | > It has been reported that while delta is more transmissible, its not more dangerous. | 00:48 |
| LjL | wut | 00:48 |
| LjL | people still saying this | 00:48 |
| LjL | (at https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/p9m164/israel_finds_covid19_vaccine_booster/) | 00:48 |
| nixonix | maybe they only listen to finnish hc officials | 00:48 |
| nixonix | saves energy. 3 dose vaccine. i guess i have to believe it | 00:53 |
| LjL | > No, 99% of people are in the hospital for covid have not been vaccinated. If they had been, their cases would have been far less severe. | 00:53 |
| nixonix | if the 3rd will last better... otherwise its a 4-dose vaccine | 00:53 |
| LjL | sigh, and this too | 00:53 |
| LjL | everyone just repeating on and on information that's old and wrong | 00:54 |
| LjL | and me barely having the mental capacity to gather all the things that show they're wrong instead of just pouting | 00:54 |
| nixonix | in the future reddit will have sound, and you can scream them | 00:55 |
| gustik | reddit is not a good idea | 00:56 |
| LjL | nixonix, i can't wait | 00:56 |
| nixonix | was that ab decay study the first of its kind? noticing a big difference between natural infection and vaccine ab kinetics | 00:58 |
| nixonix | or was it that it wasnt noticed because earlier studies were for 3 months or something | 00:59 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Burkina Faso: +14 cases (now 13713) since a day ago | 00:59 |
| LjL | i don't know, i'm slightly suspicious since the "common knowledge" seemed to be that vaccine protection was much higher than natural-infection protection | 00:59 |
| nixonix | circulating titers are higher first | 01:00 |
| nixonix | plasmablasts die in around 3 weeks, other plasma cells last longer, but they should have been able to forecast the kinetics of circulating abs earlier probably. maybe nobody wanted to say it before actual proof | 01:02 |
| nixonix | maturation issue was known before from those influenza studies. yet they only trialled 3-4 week intervals, and decided to go with those | 01:04 |
| nixonix | (not saying its proven that longer intervals help for that) | 01:04 |
| nixonix | even viral vector vaccines recommended short interval, when it should have been obvious longer is better for them at least | 01:05 |
| nixonix | a marketing ploy perhaps, fast protection with our vaccine | 01:06 |
| LjL | that was J&J's marketing ploy | 01:07 |
| lastshell | https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/african-swine-fever-may-have-made-covid-19-more-likely | 01:15 |
| LjL | "Unplugging the lab-leak myth" ← totally neutral terminology for a giant-font title... | 01:17 |
| LjL | bleh | 01:17 |
| LjL | > As with many virologists and immunologistsTrusted Source, he expects that SARS-CoV-2 and its variants will meet the same fate as the first SARS-CoV — gradually posing less danger over time. | 01:19 |
| LjL | uh, how is that the fate of SARS-CoV? | 01:19 |
| LjL | SARS basically just died out | 01:19 |
| nixonix | Novavax protein-based vaccine (NVX-CoV2373) contains additional mutations at the S1–S2 polybasic cleavage site from RRAR to SRAG or QQAQ to render it protease resistant, which helps to further stabilize the S protein in its pre-fusion conformation | 01:26 |
| nixonix | modification prob better term | 01:26 |
| LjL | when are we going to see Novavax deployed though | 01:28 |
| nixonix | they should first apply for approval | 01:31 |
| nixonix | NDV-HXP-S (known as ButanVac[2][3] or ADAPTCOV[4] in Brazil, COVIVAC[5] in Vietnam, HXP-GPOVac[6] in Thailand, Patria[7] in Mexico) is a COVID-19 vaccine candidate developed by a team led by Jason McLellan | 01:31 |
| nixonix | that uses hexapro instead of those two proline modifications. should be even more stable... | 01:32 |
| nixonix | what should we call that? | 01:32 |
| nixonix | mclellan vax | 01:32 |
| LjL | vaccine efforts seem to be so fragmented geographically | 01:34 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.07.11.451855v1.full | 01:34 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.biorxiv.org: The SARS-CoV-2 spike reversibly samples an open-trimer conformation exposing novel epitopes | bioRxiv | 01:34 |
| LjL | and informationally, we only tend to know about the ones geographically (or geopolitically?) close to us | 01:34 |
| LjL | i can't confidently say i'd heard of the one you just said before | 01:34 |
| LjL | absolutely no idea what the abstract of that paper means | 01:36 |
| LjL | not even vaguely | 01:36 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Syria: +102 cases (now 26901), +7 deaths (now 1971) since 21 hours ago — Tunisia: +2825 cases (now 640897), +80 deaths (now 22537), +12030 tests (now 2.5 million) since a day ago — Somalia: +1 deaths (now 898), +4517 tests (now 190581) since 3 days ago | 01:37 |
| twomoon | it means the spike protein is pliable | 01:37 |
| twomoon | lolol | 01:37 |
| LjL | well... yeah | 01:38 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.smh.com.au/business/companies/novavax-plans-to-trial-combined-flu-and-covid-super-jab-in-australia-20210806-p58gfk.html | 01:39 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.smh.com.au: Australia COVID: Novavax plans to trial combined flu and COVID super jab | 01:39 |
| twomoon | yay super duper jab on the way | 01:39 |
| twomoon | vaccine proof cards => vaccine rap sheets | 01:40 |
| twomoon | but oh wait if the vaccine is so good that we just need one jab every five years maybe it'll still be a little card | 01:40 |
| twomoon | wow, does HIV really have a higher R0 than the original covid virus? | 01:43 |
| twomoon | i think they made a mistake | 01:43 |
| nixonix | they probably need money. we should buy it, send the money in advance. maybe its a game changer for lasting of protection. if it isnt, it may still be useful and i think its a good bet. danes already committed | 01:45 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/eu-expects-key-data-novavax-vaccine-around-october-source-2021-08-20/ | 01:45 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.reuters.com: EU expects key data on Novavax vaccine around October - source | Reuters | 01:45 |
| nixonix | although just over 200k doses, but its something | 01:45 |
| nixonix | that article with cryptic title was about spike conformations exposing targets for antibodies, and hexapro with 4 additional proline substitutions would keep it longer in open state, helping for ab production for those hidden conserved epitopes and improving possibilities for pan-betacorona vaccines | 01:57 |
| nixonix | 280k doses. danish | 01:58 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Guinea: +11 cases (now 28658), +1 deaths (now 309), +894 tests (now 529762) since a day ago | 02:01 |
| lastshell | https://www.thedailybeast.com/dr-scott-gottlieb-25-million-kids-might-have-gotten-covid | 02:02 |
| lastshell | this virus is very strange only one fraction of the populatiob is affected | 02:03 |
| nixonix | they apparently used new improved version of hexapro that makes it prefer the newly found "state B", that exposes conserved epitopes from S2 that are otherwised hidden, and are found in sars-1 too | 02:05 |
| nixonix | perhaps supporting the idea, that while similar viral loads for the first 6 days, less viable virions or infectious units: | 02:13 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1429458907240357888 | 02:13 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): "Important work/finding by @Corine_GvK and @ErasmusMC team. Breakthrough (nearly all Delta) infections in healthcare workers had less viral culture positivity than primary [...] | 02:13 |
| archpc | I have acquired the pulse oximeter | 02:20 |
| archpc | It’s just a cvs | 02:22 |
| archpc | Erm, cvs brand one * | 02:22 |
| archpc | Reviews online say it’s absolute trash though | 02:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Coronavirus: Unvaccinated adults 50+ are 17x more likely to die than vaxxed counterparts → https://is.gd/WBiN0V | 02:32 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for France: +9985 cases (now 6.6 million) since 22 hours ago — Netherlands: +1893 cases (now 1.9 million), +6 deaths (now 18111) since 22 hours ago — Canada: +802 cases (now 1.5 million) since 22 hours ago — United Kingdom: +51 deaths (now 131775) since 22 hours ago | 02:39 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Grenada: +10 cases (now 222), +148 tests (now 54402) since a day ago | 03:04 |
| archpc | I ran it 4 times, 83 82 82 83 | 03:05 |
| de-facto | uh thats low | 03:05 |
| de-facto | it should be in the 90s | 03:06 |
| archpc | I mean, I feel.. fine, as bad as earlier, not much worse | 03:06 |
| de-facto | did you try the other hand? | 03:06 |
| de-facto | finger of the other hand or such | 03:06 |
| de-facto | 83 is low, not so good | 03:07 |
| archpc | I’m trying it on my other hand | 03:07 |
| de-facto | the problem is, we dont have a reference value for you, e.g. what your normal saturation would be without your covid condition | 03:07 |
| archpc | Actually, I have one | 03:08 |
| archpc | I have my health records linked with Apple health | 03:08 |
| de-facto | not sure how comparable that is | 03:09 |
| archpc | 95-99 | 03:09 |
| de-facto | yeah that would be normal | 03:09 |
| archpc | yeah, I figured it’s not an exact comparison | 03:09 |
| de-facto | hmm idk what to make from that, if its really 83 it would be too low | 03:10 |
| archpc | Other hand is 84-85 | 03:11 |
| twomoon | is it possible for covid to morph to affect kids more than adults? | 03:12 |
| de-facto | hmm archpc who is with you there? | 03:12 |
| archpc | at the moment nobody | 03:12 |
| de-facto | and usually? | 03:13 |
| archpc | My roommate who gifted me the plague | 03:13 |
| de-facto | ok so she is also positive anyhow | 03:13 |
| archpc | She didn’t get retested but is somehow cleared | 03:14 |
| de-facto | but she was positive? | 03:15 |
| archpc | Yeah, last time she got tested was the 10th, the clinic refused to test her because it’s too soon and she’ll still be positive because the virus stays in your system for a while, and she interpreted that as all clear | 03:16 |
| de-facto | i am asking because she could test it on her finger too (and then wash her hands just in case) to see if that device gives higher values for her | 03:16 |
| de-facto | and also, honestly, if your values are that low that someone is there just in case | 03:17 |
| archpc | I don’t want her near me, for both of our health’s sake | 03:17 |
| de-facto | yeah i understand | 03:17 |
| de-facto | hmm | 03:17 |
| de-facto | assuming that device measures somewhat accurate values (afaik nowadays even those cheap ones are capable of doing that), its too low | 03:18 |
| de-facto | i am not a doctor, so i dont know how dramatic that value really is, but the tables in the internet say in the 90s it should be | 03:19 |
| de-facto | you could take that as reference and monitor if it goes up or down with time | 03:20 |
| de-facto | but it may indicate that you need some medical care, idk | 03:20 |
| de-facto | also, if you can, try to open the window for fresh air to come in | 03:21 |
| de-facto | archpc, can you call a MD on the phone and ask what you should do about that value? | 03:23 |
| archpc | I will in the morning | 03:24 |
| de-facto | i am a bit worried, if it goes up again, ok, but if it stays like that or goes down, its not good | 03:24 |
| LjL | archpc, most cheap pulse oximeters are about equally trash... can you link to the model? | 03:24 |
| de-facto | if we just knew it would measure 90-something in non-covid people it would indicate that this is lower than normal | 03:25 |
| archpc | https://www.cvs.com/shop/cvs-health-pulse-oximeter-prodid-814854 LjL | 03:26 |
| LjL | archpc, does the hand that measures lower feel any colder than the other? or any different? | 03:26 |
| LjL | argh | 03:26 |
| LjL | "CVS.com® is not available to customers or patients who are located outside of the United States or U.S. territories. We apologize for any inconvenience. " | 03:26 |
| archpc | no difference | 03:26 |
| archpc | LjL I’ll screenshot | 03:26 |
| LjL | i'll try archive.org or google archive | 03:26 |
| LjL | uh instead of the old menu with google's cache, i get a "beta" window with a bunch of information on the search terms that led to my results now in google hits... | 03:27 |
| archpc | Wtf | 03:27 |
| LjL | anyway it's on archive.org so who cares | 03:27 |
| LjL | archpc, hmm that's too bad, that looks like it has a pixel-based screen (some are just 7-segment displays) BUT YET no graph, just the numbers | 03:28 |
| de-facto | https://archive.is/sHtq2 | 03:29 |
| LjL | but still, these things tend to be quite similar to each other. based on what the screen looks like, the software even seems related to the one on mine | 03:29 |
| LjL | thanks de-facto but i managed with archive.org | 03:29 |
| archpc | Well, I sent a friend that website and told them to show the people at the store that | 03:29 |
| archpc | so it’s better than nothing for now haha | 03:29 |
| de-facto | "Oxygen level readings by a pulse oximeter are typically with a margin of 2% over or under what the number would be when measured by arterial gas saturation testing method. For example, if the reading is 93% on the pulse oximeter, the actual oxygen level might be somewhere between 91 to 95%. Keep your hands still during the measurement. Body motion or temperature can impact accuracy. Readings may be less accurate if a person is wearing nail polish | 03:30 |
| de-facto | or artificial nails, and places the sensor over the nail. Accuracy can also be affected by cold hands or poor circulation. | 03:30 |
| de-facto | " | 03:30 |
| de-facto | archpc, do you have nail polish or such? | 03:30 |
| archpc | No | 03:30 |
| de-facto | whats the temp there? | 03:31 |
| de-facto | like room temp | 03:31 |
| archpc | Uh, warmer than normal, like 80-85 | 03:31 |
| LjL | archpc, anyway i don't know what's up with the difference in hands, but i agree that 83% or so is *low*. i'd tell anyone with those readings to go to hospital, but i know you've tried, so i dunno what to tell you, except next time, tell them "i have 83% oxygen saturation" | 03:32 |
| archpc | I will | 03:32 |
| de-facto | also monitor the trajectory, note values and time in a table | 03:33 |
| de-facto | like date, time, saturation, temp | 03:33 |
| archpc | The hospital system here is very strained, so if I can stay home and not die I’d rather someone who needs care more can get it | 03:33 |
| de-facto | just so that you can see if any trends establish, if values tend to go up or down | 03:34 |
| archpc | de-facto, will do | 03:34 |
| LjL | archpc, i understand, but to be clear, 83% is generally "this person needs to be put on oxygen" kind of low | 03:34 |
| archpc | 😳 | 03:35 |
| archpc | I wasn’t aware | 03:35 |
| LjL | %s happy hypoxia | 03:36 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, 0 hits: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silent_hypoxia (Silent hypoxia) | 03:36 |
| LjL | some people with COVID have lower than normal saturation (sometimes much lower than normal) and yet don't seem to feel severely out of breath, for some reason | 03:36 |
| LjL | you'll find a lot of hits if you google "happy hypoxic" since that's what they were dubbed | 03:36 |
| archpc | Yeah, I feel.. “fine” given my low blood o2 | 03:37 |
| lastshell | archpc not sure if this works https://youtu.be/OluG8T9asl4 but i know in new york some patiens where upside down so has some logic | 03:37 |
| de-facto | also room temp is ok, fingers should have well open blood vessels | 03:37 |
| de-facto | so i assume that measurement there is accurate within 2% or such | 03:37 |
| LjL | archpc, this may be a bit difficult since becoming conscious of breathing tends to change it... but can you try to stay relaxed, breathe normally, and measure how many breathes you take in one minute? | 03:40 |
| archpc | I’ll attempt to yea | 03:40 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for S. Sudan: +67 cases (now 11310) since 2 days ago | 03:41 |
| archpc | About 40 | 03:42 |
| LjL | archpc, is that counting breathing in and out separately? like in counts for 1 and out another 1? | 03:42 |
| archpc | In and out is 1 | 03:43 |
| LjL | ok | 03:43 |
| LjL | so when you call, tell them your saturation is around 83% and you have 40 breaths per minute | 03:43 |
| LjL | both things are important, also what does the oximeter say your heartrate is? (if you're going to note the values down, note that one too) | 03:44 |
| de-facto | archpc, what was your temp again? | 03:47 |
| archpc | My Apple Watch says 110, oximeter 100, my temp? Uhhhh let me check | 03:48 |
| archpc | I have the series 3, I sold my 6 which had a rudimentary oximeter | 03:49 |
| LjL | didn't the Apple Watch itself contain a pulse oximeter? or just some newer models? | 03:49 |
| LjL | ah | 03:49 |
| LjL | yeah probably not a very reliable oximeter because it's reflective | 03:49 |
| de-facto | the apple watch yeah | 03:49 |
| archpc | Isn’t it FDA approved? | 03:49 |
| LjL | i'm not sure, i think here it's "just for recreation" | 03:49 |
| de-facto | archpc, when did you last time open the window and replaced the air in the room? | 03:50 |
| archpc | Well, it’s literally hot soup air outside so I have a air dehumidifier /ac on 24/ | 03:51 |
| de-facto | or: does the saturation get better if you stay at open window? | 03:51 |
| LjL | Apple has taken a different path for the Apple Watch Series 6’s blood oxygen monitor. The FDA guidelines allow for a company to sell pulse oximeters without clearance, so long as the product is clearly marketed as a “wellness” tool. As such, the company can’t claim that it can diagnose or treat any medical conditions. | 03:51 |
| archpc | 24/7 | 03:51 |
| LjL | https://9to5mac.com/2020/10/07/new-report-explains-why-the-apple-watch-series-6s-blood-oxygen-monitor-didnt-require-fda-approval/ | 03:51 |
| archpc | https://www.apple.com/healthcare/docs/site/Apple_ECG_app_during_COVID-19.pdf | 03:51 |
| LjL | don't confuse the ECG with the pulse oximeter, different features | 03:51 |
| LjL | they did have to obtain FDA clearance for the ECG | 03:51 |
| archpc | Yeah, I’m aware | 03:52 |
| LjL | (but still, it's a shitty single-electrode ECG, it's nowhere near a normal medical ECG) | 03:52 |
| archpc | Ahhh | 03:52 |
| lastshell | archpc try to follow the video i pasted to get more oxygen | 03:54 |
| de-facto | and also try to replace the air with fresh one from outdoors | 03:54 |
| archpc | lastshell, the first position made me feel like I was being crushed and strangled :| | 03:55 |
| archpc | de-facto, the windows are usually open overnight, when it cools down | 03:56 |
| lastshell | oh better stop if you dont feeling fine | 03:56 |
| archpc | Yeah, it’s why I didn’t respond, I didn’t want to sound rude | 03:56 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: Coronavirus: Young people warn of long Covid amid jab drive: The government says it has met its target to offer all 16 and 17-year-olds in England a vaccine. → https://is.gd/SKFUJM | 03:58 |
| archpc | lastshell, I do appreciate it though, just the positions.. aren’t helpful right now | 03:58 |
| de-facto | yeah i am just trying to help, tbh i am a bit worried, your value is about 10% too low, i think you should call an MD about that | 03:59 |
| LjL | lastshell, archpc: careful with "do it yourself" techniques, one thing is getting measurements, but if someone is sick, getting into various positions can precipitate things. it could also help, but it really should be done under medical supervision, not while he's there alone | 03:59 |
| archpc | de-facto, that comment wasn’t toward you bud :) | 04:00 |
| de-facto | yeah i know | 04:00 |
| archpc | And I’ll call my doctor in the morning when they’re open | 04:00 |
| de-facto | cant you call a hotline or such? | 04:01 |
| de-facto | i think you should call them now, not tomorrow | 04:01 |
| LjL | i think so too but... he already called hospitals and was turned away | 04:01 |
| archpc | Well, as I said, I don’t want to strain our already maxed out system | 04:01 |
| archpc | I’m in rural Appalachia, covid is body slamming us | 04:02 |
| LjL | gah | 04:02 |
| LjL | archpc, can you please just put that thought away while your saturation is below 90%? you've already had COVID before, you're having it worse now, you have baseline asthma which is considered a worrisome comorbidity | 04:03 |
| LjL | you are very well entitled to receive care | 04:03 |
| archpc | alright fine :| I’ll get my roommate to drive me to the hospital | 04:04 |
| archpc | sorry, I’m just very stubborn sometimes | 04:04 |
| LjL | archpc, it's not my decision, it's your decision. i just don't think THAT particular concern should factor in, right now | 04:04 |
| de-facto | we are just trying to help but we are not MDs, i think its a very good decision to let someone professional take a look at you | 04:05 |
| archpc | I understand that, yeah | 04:05 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for South Korea: +1416 cases (now 237782), +7 deaths (now 2222), +29686 tests (now 12.7 million) since 22 hours ago | 04:06 |
| LjL | archpc, whatever you decide though, if those pulse oximeter readings keep going down, and after verifying with your roommate that your pulse oximeter is not just giving odd reading, in that case, *definitely* go to hospital | 04:06 |
| LjL | (or if your breathing rate keeps going up, ideally measured by your roommate, too... because right now you're breathing about twice as fast as it's considered normal for an adult) | 04:07 |
| archpc | I’m keeping a close eye on it | 04:08 |
| LjL | (since you have asthma that may be normal for you to some extent, but not to this extent) | 04:08 |
| LjL | archpc, last thing and then i'll stop bothering you, i also agree that someone should be with you, at all times if possible | 04:12 |
| archpc | LjL, my roommate may increase my viral load (???) and she’s the only one who really is able to be here | 04:14 |
| archpc | because I GUARANTEE she isn’t covid free yet | 04:15 |
| de-facto | hmm but both of you have it, so the viral load inside your body probably is much higher than what you can breathe on each other, and both of you should have same variant, probably that damn delta | 04:17 |
| archpc | To be honest I have *no* idea how viral load works | 04:18 |
| LjL | archpc, i'm not sure at this point she can worsen your viral load very much, but fair | 04:19 |
| LjL | archpc, also just in passing, if she definitely isn't covid-free, what exactly is she doing outside ;( | 04:20 |
| LjL | can you frown to her on my behalf | 04:20 |
| archpc | Between us, she’s an idiot | 04:20 |
| LjL | archpc, well, then you know what, since you want to be generous and let others have hospital beds... be generous in another way: keep your roommate inside looking after you and making sure you can be taken to hospital quickly if you need to, instead of being outside infecting more people :P | 04:21 |
| archpc | That’s the plan | 04:22 |
| archpc | Like, I get she feels fine and I’m no virologist but I’m sure she’s still breathing the spiky balls of death around | 04:23 |
| de-facto | did she ever had symptoms? | 04:23 |
| LjL | archpc, to be fair most of the viral shedding appears to happen a day or two before symptoms start, and then go down somewhat | 04:24 |
| archpc | Flu-like, mind fatigue | 04:24 |
| archpc | Abh | 04:27 |
| archpc | ahh | 04:27 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Egypt: +184 cases (now 286352), +8 deaths (now 16671) since a day ago | 04:31 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Resounding popular support for decision to take New Zealand into strict lockdown → https://is.gd/0zZQOO | 05:13 |
| LjL | see? where lockdowns have *worked* because they have been *strict* (and real lockdowns in the first place), people still want them when the virus is out there | 05:15 |
| LjL | but i don't know if even strict lockdowns will work to get "zero covid" with delta, anyway. i think it marks the point of no return | 05:22 |
| lunatunes | I think if done for long enough it would but everyone in the world would have to work together which won't happen. so yeah its here to stay | 05:24 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Pakistan: +3772 cases (now 1.1 million), +80 deaths (now 25003), +53881 tests (now 17.3 million) since 21 hours ago | 05:33 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: Taiwan’s president leads way in first domestic Covid-19 shot → https://is.gd/e4SOne | 05:33 |
| LjL | %title https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1429523296349872131 | 05:38 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: From twitter.com: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): "Take note. Keep your guard up. Don't give your vaccination a Delta stress test. (aligns with prior posts that we don't have a true handle on US Delta breakthroughs, and [...] | 05:38 |
| archpc | Yeehaw | 05:39 |
| LjL | archpc, yeah, we may also want to send you as evidence to Eric Topol | 05:40 |
| archpc | Brain biopsy? | 05:45 |
| LjL | archpc, i only meant evidence that Delta is nasty even on someone who's been vaccinated AND had covid before, not a diss on your brain | 05:47 |
| LjL | but i'd recommend against a brain biopsy in most cases anyway | 05:48 |
| archpc | I know haha | 05:50 |
| LjL | archpc, still 83-ish? | 05:54 |
| archpc | Yeah, as of 27 minutes ago | 05:57 |
| archpc | Heart rate still awfully high | 05:58 |
| LjL | archpc, 100 or so is... certainly high, but you'd probably expect that | 05:58 |
| LjL | 83% and high breathing rate is more concerning in my book | 05:59 |
| lastshell | how old are you ? 100 is not that high based on your physical activity and age | 05:59 |
| archpc | 25 | 05:59 |
| archpc | but also, I’ve been in bed | 05:59 |
| lastshell | are you doing exercise rigjt now ? | 06:00 |
| lastshell | fuck | 06:00 |
| lastshell | yeah is high | 06:00 |
| LjL | i doubt he's in a condition to do exercise :P | 06:00 |
| archpc | yeah I’m totally running and doing sit ups xD | 06:00 |
| archpc | i can barely walk without dying | 06:00 |
| LjL | i have 100 and often 115 or so at rest, and i'm not dead yet | 06:00 |
| LjL | that's not saying much, i'm clearly not in a great physical or mental shape | 06:00 |
| LjL | just you know... it's not an *immediate* reason for concern | 06:01 |
| archpc | I gotcha | 06:01 |
| lastshell | https://images.onhealth.com/images/slideshow/whats-a-healthy-and-normal-heart-rate-for-my-age/whats-a-healthy-and-normal-heart-rate-for-my-age-s7-chart-resting-heart-rate-values-for-adult-men.jpg | 06:04 |
| archpc | It’s at 82 as of 12, breathing hasn’t changed | 06:04 |
| LjL | %wa time in texas | 06:04 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, Wolfram|Alpha (current time in Texas (US state)): Time offset from CEST: -7 hours → https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=time+in+texas | 06:04 |
| LjL | Brainstorm, thank you but you could have done the subtraction for me ;( | 06:05 |
| archpc | I’m on the east coast USA | 06:05 |
| LjL | oh | 06:05 |
| LjL | i don't know why i had it in my mind you were in texas | 06:05 |
| archpc | I’m curious why lol | 06:05 |
| LjL | might have been someone else here, i've got some memory issues, i confuse things | 06:06 |
| archpc | Yeah same here | 06:06 |
| lastshell | ljl you also have covid ? | 06:06 |
| LjL | TurboTech is from Texas, i think | 06:06 |
| LjL | lastshell, no, i just have anxiety and depression ;( | 06:07 |
| archpc | Same | 06:07 |
| lastshell | i recommed excercise | 06:07 |
| lastshell | changed my life | 06:07 |
| archpc | I’m physically active, I hike run and bike a lot | 06:07 |
| LjL | first i should start not being awake at 6am, so that i can get exercise during daylight | 06:07 |
| archpc | My mental health improved a lot once I got off night shifts | 06:11 |
| LjL | archpc, just reading random bits from the internet, read a lot of this stuff before but i don't have any particular thing, but just to give you an idea of what 82-83% typically entails | 06:11 |
| LjL | "For this reason, it would be helpful if those patients were able to monitor their oxygen saturation so that if they dipped down to the mid-80s or lower, they could use supplemental oxygen [at a hospital]," said Horovitz, who practices at Lenox Hill Hospital in New York City. | 06:11 |
| LjL | https://www.comhs.org/about-us/newsroom/health-library/2020/04/29/what-is-a-pulse-oximeter-and-should-you-get-one-to-warn-of-covid19 | 06:11 |
| archpc | So.. I shouldn’t be huffing oxygen from my car tires? | 06:12 |
| LjL | i fully believe fixing my sleep pattern would help at least a bit. but i don't do it. | 06:12 |
| gry | LjL: i had a broken sleep pattern until i had about 3-4 awake nights for an overseas virtual meeting | 06:12 |
| LjL | archpc, i'm not sure it's oxygen they're filled with... | 06:12 |
| gry | LjL: then i came back to normal, and it was more normal than the normal | 06:12 |
| LjL | gry, hmm, not the first time i get told to just skip a night | 06:13 |
| gry | LjL: waking up at 5am is cool, i hear birds and the sunrise is happening before my eyes - splendid | 06:13 |
| LjL | scary though | 06:13 |
| LjL | well, the sunrise *is* happening before my eyes, also birds etc | 06:13 |
| gry | LjL: that does, however, imply going to bed at around 8-9pm | 06:13 |
| LjL | just, when i'm about to go to sleep :P | 06:13 |
| gry | LjL: there are two most useful time slots for sleep: 10pm-2am and noon-3pm | 06:13 |
| lastshell | i also strugle with sleep, just 4 or 5 hrs if im lucky | 06:14 |
| gry | LjL: it is i think better to be asleep at least during one of these two time slots | 06:14 |
| LjL | archpc, i'm going to bed now... just, you know, these oximeters have a ±2 tolerance, so sometimes it may be 83% sometimes 84% sometimes 82%... but if it goes consistently below that, please please go to hospital (consider going anyway, but just in addition) | 06:14 |
| LjL | gry, why is that? | 06:15 |
| archpc | Goodnight man, thanks for the advice | 06:15 |
| archpc | I’ll be here | 06:15 |
| gry | LjL: when i am sleep deprived, these are the two time slots when the body asks for a nap the most. | 06:15 |
| gry | LjL: part of the body cycle, i think. | 06:15 |
| LjL | i guess | 06:15 |
| gry | LjL: what i am arguing though is that i've observed this in several people and i suspect you might have the same body cycle with the same or roughly similar times for most efficient sleep. | 06:16 |
| LjL | right now 10pm is when i have dinner, and i've never slept that early, so i'd have to reshuffle things a fair bit | 06:17 |
| * archpc puts a pillow over LjL, “shhhh” | 06:21 | |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Why a US military base became a centre for Chinese Covid conspiracies → https://is.gd/ULNEeA | 06:49 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: New Zealand reports another 35 Covid cases as nationwide lockdown extended → https://is.gd/XW6NYb | 07:20 |
| archpc | It’s crazy seeing other countries take it somewhat seriously | 07:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): Covid2019: NY Times - A Hospital Finds an Unlikely Group Opposing Vaccination: Its Workers → https://is.gd/yfnPk4 | 07:31 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Arizona, United States: +6502 cases (now 986082), +39 deaths (now 18600) since 2 days ago — Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, Pakistan: +783 cases (now 157148), +25 deaths (now 4797) since 23 hours ago — Mie, Japan: +432 cases (now 9227), +2 deaths (now 121) since 23 hours ago — Stavropol, Russia: +351 cases (now 72022), +19 deaths (now 2149) since 23 hours ago | 07:37 |
| ZdrytchX | !help | 07:41 |
| ZdrytchX | .help | 07:41 |
| Brainstorm | ZdrytchX: Hi, I am LjL's bot! Say %modules or %commands to me in private to see my features. | 07:41 |
| ZdrytchX | %commands | 07:41 |
| Brainstorm | ZdrytchX, all exposed commands: act, anagrams, ask, bible, book, bug, commands, count, dick, echo, evaluate, geo, grammar, greet, help, language_code, language_identify, languages, last, link_get, link_put, lojban, modules, more, morphology, onelook, phonology_change, ping, pronunciation, search, seen, spell, spell2, stock [... want %more?] (try %help <command>, or %modules for a directory) | 07:41 |
| ZdrytchX | %bible | 07:41 |
| Brainstorm | ZdrytchX: Give me a search term or location (verset, etc.) and optionally a source to search within. Example: Genesis 1:1 in KJV | 07:41 |
| ZdrytchX | %dick | 07:41 |
| Brainstorm | AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'rstrip' (file "/home/brainstorm/brainstorm/bot/modules/dick.py", line 85, in dick) | 07:41 |
| ZdrytchX | %link_get | 07:42 |
| Brainstorm | ZdrytchX: Give me a term to search for and/or a language in the form "<language term"! | 07:42 |
| ZdrytchX | %spell2 | 07:42 |
| zutt | protip: you can query the bot too.. | 07:42 |
| ZdrytchX | like direct message? | 07:42 |
| zutt | yes, /query Brainstorm | 07:42 |
| ZdrytchX | ive been using irc for like 10 years and ive never heard of that command lol | 07:43 |
| ZdrytchX | or rather never used it | 07:43 |
| ZdrytchX | so is /query basically /msg? | 07:44 |
| ZdrytchX | also the reason why i was dumping here is because some bots dont accept direct messages | 07:44 |
| zutt | msg is alias for query | 07:44 |
| zutt | in IRC terms, private messages are queries | 07:44 |
| ZdrytchX | o.o ok lol | 07:44 |
| zutt | legacy thing, some clients are a bit confusing | 07:45 |
| ZdrytchX | wasnt there abot where you could index current cases for a given location? it was something like .covid <location> but it doesnt seem to be Brainstorm | 07:46 |
| zutt | yeah, not sure if it works anymore | 07:58 |
| zutt | %cases sweden | 07:58 |
| Brainstorm | zutt: Sweden has had 1.1 million confirmed cases (10.8% of all people) and 14662 deaths (1.3% of cases) as of 2 days ago. 11.5 million tests were done (9.7% positive). 6.6 million were vaccinated (64.3%). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Sweden | 07:58 |
| Brainstorm | zutt: If you know of an official or otherwise good site for data about Sweden, with a reasonably short URL, please %tell LjL about it. | 07:58 |
| zutt | datasources are apparently not being updated/reliable or something | 07:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: Covid cases overwhelm Gulf Coast, leaving region with no ICU beds → https://is.gd/u5jNu5 | 08:03 |
| archpc | How specific does the % cases go | 08:04 |
| archpc | %cases North Carolina l | 08:05 |
| Brainstorm | archpc: Sorry, North Carolina l not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name. | 08:05 |
| archpc | %cases North Carolina | 08:05 |
| Brainstorm | archpc: North Carolina, United States has had 1.1 million confirmed cases (11.4% of all people) and 14059 deaths (1.2% of cases) as of 2 days ago. 2.0 million tests were done (56.7% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=North%20Carolina | 08:05 |
| Brainstorm | archpc: If you know of an official or otherwise good site for data about North Carolina, with a reasonably short URL, please %tell LjL about it. | 08:05 |
| zutt | %cases finland | 08:06 |
| Brainstorm | zutt: Finland has had 122046 confirmed cases (2.2% of all people) and 1011 deaths (0.8% of cases) as of 18 hours ago. 6.3 million tests were done (1.9% positive). 3.9 million were vaccinated (71.1%). +503 cases since 11 hours ago. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Finland | 08:06 |
| Brainstorm | zutt: If you know of an official or otherwise good site for data about Finland, with a reasonably short URL, please %tell LjL about it. | 08:06 |
| archpc | %cases McDowell County, North Carolina | 08:07 |
| Brainstorm | archpc: Sorry, McDowell County, North Carolina not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name. | 08:07 |
| archpc | Fair enough | 08:07 |
| zutt | LjL: official (open,free)api for covid cases in Finland https://thl.fi/en/web/thlfi-en/statistics/statistical-databases/open-data/confirmed-corona-cases-in-finland-covid-19- | 08:10 |
| ZdrytchX | oh its just not listed' | 08:11 |
| ZdrytchX | %cases perth western australoia | 08:11 |
| Brainstorm | ZdrytchX: Sorry, perth western australoia not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name. | 08:11 |
| ZdrytchX | %cases perth western australia | 08:11 |
| Brainstorm | ZdrytchX: Sorry, perth western australia not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name. | 08:11 |
| ZdrytchX | %cases perth | 08:11 |
| Brainstorm | ZdrytchX: Sorry, perth not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name. | 08:11 |
| ZdrytchX | %cases western australia | 08:11 |
| Brainstorm | ZdrytchX: Western Australia, Australia has had 1063 confirmed cases (0.0% of all people) and 10 deaths (0.9% of cases) as of 2 days ago. 23118 tests were done (4.6% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Western%20Australia | 08:12 |
| Brainstorm | ZdrytchX: If you know of an official or otherwise good site for data about Western Australia, with a reasonably short URL, please %tell LjL about it. | 08:12 |
| ZdrytchX | so i think it only recognises states but not cities since for example, there are two "Perth"s in the world | 08:13 |
| ZdrytchX | i thought we'd be able to narrow it down by <state> <city> o r something | 08:13 |
| zutt | many places dont report information that accurately | 08:14 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: China reports no new local COVID-19 cases for first time since July → https://is.gd/z8krlN | 08:35 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Venezuela: +1074 cases (now 325716), +9 deaths (now 3895) since a day ago | 08:39 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Daily Discussion Thread | August 23, 2021: Please refer to our Wiki for more information on COVID-19 and our sub. You can find answers to frequently asked questions in our FAQ , where there is valuable information such as our: → https://is.gd/Zj3XpD | 09:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: Coronavirus forces US to get a crash course in scientific uncertainty → https://is.gd/bdgbxh | 09:17 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for India: +25072 cases (now 32.4 million), +269 deaths (now 434636) since a day ago | 09:30 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Israel: +3846 cases (now 991856), +104699 tests (now 18.5 million) since 23 hours ago — Saint Lucia: +121 cases (now 7232), +433 tests (now 65853) since 23 hours ago — Czechia: +107 cases (now 1.7 million), +67767 tests (now 35.3 million) since a day ago — Taiwan: +6 cases (now 15932), +22279 tests (now 4.7 million) since 23 hours ago | 10:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Taiwan's president leads way in first domestic COVID-19 vaccine → https://is.gd/4mttcx | 10:31 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Chandigarh, India: +3004 cases (now 65066) since a day ago | 10:32 |
| Brainstorm | New from EMA: What's new: Medicine: Veterinary medicines European public assessment report (EPAR): Nobivac DP Plus, Canine distemper vaccine (live, attenuated) and canine parvovirus vaccine (live, recombinant), Date of authorisation: 09/12/2020, Status: Authorised → https://is.gd/RGz4gV | 10:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from StatNews: A lucky few seem ‘resistant’ to Covid-19. Scientists want to know why: A small number of people may have won a sort of biological lottery — they appear to be naturally immune to the coronavirus that has killed more than 4 million… → https://is.gd/i2eQtw | 11:04 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Philippines: +18011 cases (now 1.9 million), +151 deaths (now 31961) since a day ago — Estonia: +319 cases (now 139126), +4 deaths (now 1285), +3677 tests (now 1.7 million) since a day ago — Slovakia: +11 cases (now 394093), +943 tests (now 3.3 million) since a day ago | 11:09 |
| archpc | Blood oxygen is now 80-82 | 11:18 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Russia: +19454 cases (now 6.8 million), +776 deaths (now 176820), +371094 tests (now 175.5 million) since a day ago — Hungary: +340 cases (now 811121), +6 deaths (now 30052) since 3 days ago — Japan: +22914 cases (now 1.3 million), +35 deaths (now 15631), +58970 tests (now 20.7 million) since 23 hours ago [... want %more?] | 11:34 |
| Brainstorm | New from BMJ: How South Africa is dragging its vaccine rollout back from the brink: It’s a winter of discontent in South Africa. Only a small fraction of the population is fully vaccinated as the country grapples with a third wave dominated by the Delta variant of covid-19. This... → https://is.gd/whSqYR | 11:58 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Austria: +1077 cases (now 677603), +1 deaths (now 10763), +284054 tests (now 74.1 million) since 21 hours ago | 11:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express (Health): Art and Culture: Berlin’s Neue Nationalgalerie reopens after 6-year overhaul → https://is.gd/jvOom3 | 12:09 |
| de-facto | archpc, you need some medical care, oxygen and supervision, i think you should go into hospital as soon as possible, your blood oxygenation was 10% too low, now its almost 15% too low, that trajectory is concerning | 12:30 |
| de-facto | we have no reason to believe its going to recover without medical intervention, hence treatment is urgently needed imho | 12:31 |
| de-facto | you said you were at 84%-85% 9h ago, now you say its 80%-82% that sounds alarming to me | 12:41 |
| indoanon[m] | O_o | 12:47 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Taiwan rolls out homegrown vaccine amid criticism → https://is.gd/WXZI31 | 12:52 |
| * darsie has 98% SpO2 and 70 pulse. | 13:00 | |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Gibraltar: +3 cases (now 5290), +274 tests (now 330405) since 23 hours ago | 13:01 |
| Brainstorm | New from Pfizer: Pfizer to Acquire Trillium Therapeutics Inc.: Anonymous (not verified) Mon, 08/23/2021 - 06:45 Monday, August 23, 2021 - 06:45am Proposed acquisition strengthens Pfizer’s category leadership in Oncology with addition of next-generation, investigational immuno-therapeutics for hematological malignancies Expands innovative pipeline, [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/KGOt7R | 13:03 |
| de-facto | archpc, dont wait any longer, pack the things you need for stay in hospital and seek professional medical care in a hospital immediately | 13:05 |
| * darsie got his blood SpO2 down to 78% with hyperventilation and breath holding. | 13:07 | |
| de-facto | yeah for a short time, but not for hours | 13:10 |
| de-facto | and that its going down with time is worrying, this needs to be stopped with medical care, probably, idk, with oxygen and maybe some anti-inflammatory treatment? | 13:12 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): China_Flu: Israel sees its highest infection rate since start of 4th COVID wave → https://is.gd/32sfk5 | 13:25 |
| pwr22 | archpc: how're you feeling in yourself now? | 13:32 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Romania: +415 cases (now 1.1 million), +13 deaths (now 34425), +14952 tests (now 11.2 million) since a day ago — Germany: +5312 cases (now 3.9 million) since 23 hours ago — Iceland: +62 cases (now 10177), +3652 tests (now 945877) since 22 hours ago — Malta: +57 cases (now 35831), +2656 tests (now 1.2 million) since a day ago | 13:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from BMJ: Covid-19: US hospitals are overwhelmed as cases rise at “alarming rate”: The representative body of more than 5000 hospitals in the US has appealed to the federal government to release more than $48bn (£35.1bn; €40.9bn) to help them cope with a 43% increase in covid-19... → https://is.gd/wcbwkN | 13:46 |
| de-facto | have to go for now, i hope for the best, keep us informed | 13:54 |
| Brainstorm | New from Politico: UK buys 35M extra BioNTech/Pfizer coronavirus vaccine doses: The deal opens the door to more questions on whether the UK's purchase will mean that there are fewer vaccines available for countries with much lower vaccination rates. → https://is.gd/uZGoYU | 14:19 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: UK orders 35 million more Pfizer vaccine doses: The government say it is preparing for Covid boosters to protect the most vulnerable this year. → https://is.gd/ZbunbB | 14:29 |
| specing | > UK's purchase will mean that there are fewer vaccines available for countries with much lower vaccination rates. | 14:31 |
| specing | nah, I doubt those countries are buying $40/person vaccines | 14:31 |
| specing | when AZ is what, $8 /person and J&J $10? | 14:32 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for UAE: +1060 cases (now 710438), +4 deaths (now 2024), +290691 tests (now 72.2 million) since a day ago — Laos: +152 cases (now 12621), +2427 tests (now 360617) since 10 hours ago — Zambia: +102 cases (now 204651), +4 deaths (now 3578), +3486 tests (now 2.2 million) since a day ago — Switzerland: +3 deaths (now 10944), +69615 tests (now 9.6 million) since 2 days ago | 14:40 |
| archpc | I'm here sorry, been falling in and out of sleep | 14:56 |
| dTal | hey buddy | 15:00 |
| dTal | is someone keeping an eye on you? | 15:00 |
| archpc | my roommate is here yeah | 15:01 |
| dTal | That's good. Is the weather warm enough to keep the windows open? | 15:04 |
| archpc | Yes but it'll start getting too hot soon so I need to close them | 15:04 |
| archpc | de-facto, 82-84 | 15:08 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Australian town shoots and kills shelter-bound dogs over coronavirus concerns → https://is.gd/t7WOcn | 15:12 |
| lunatunes | Are there any studies about the changes of catching delta with a kf94 mask? | 15:16 |
| lunatunes | chances* | 15:16 |
| dTal | archpc, how do you feel? | 15:24 |
| archpc | like a counterfeit million bucks | 15:25 |
| archpc | (Horrible) | 15:25 |
| dTal | Hah. Shit, man. It's supposed to not be too bad if you're vaxxed. | 15:26 |
| archpc | Fuck me I guess hahaha | 15:27 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Palestine: +1324 cases (now 327634), +5 deaths (now 3642) since 21 hours ago — Nepal: +1548 cases (now 748981), +24 deaths (now 10533) since a day ago — Guernsey: +31 cases (now 1180) since 2 days ago — San Marino: +30 cases (now 5261), +922 tests (now 74465) since 6 days ago | 15:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from StatNews: Pharma: STAT+: Pharmalittle: Pfizer to buy Trillium in $2.3 billion deal; Israel data find additional vaccine dose lowers Covid risk → https://is.gd/gsXPiM | 15:34 |
| lastshell | https://www.mercurynews.com/2021/08/22/exclusive-first-u-s-covid-deaths-came-earlier-and-in-different-places-than-previously-thought/amp/ | 15:44 |
| Brainstorm | New from StatNews: FDA grants full approval to Covid-19 vaccine developed by Pfizer, BioNTech: Health experts hope the full approval of Pfizer's Covid-19 vaccine will persuade some people who remain hesitant about it to get the shot. → https://is.gd/uaJern | 15:45 |
| Jbwncster | CNN — The US Food and Drug Administration on Monday granted full approval to the Pfizer/BioNTech Covid-19 vaccine for people age 16 and older. This is the first coronavirus vaccine approved by the FDA, and is expected to open the door to more vaccine mandates. | 15:47 |
| Brainstorm | New from WebMD: Pandemic Unveils Growing Suicide Crisis for Communities of Color: Suicides have risen among Black, Hispanic and other communities of color during covid. But the rates were already escalating before the pandemic struck. → https://is.gd/miVe8y | 15:56 |
| Brainstorm | New from WebMD: Breaking: FDA Fully Approves Pfizer COVID-19 Vaccine: It is the first COVID-19 vaccine to be fully licensed in the U.S. It will be marketed under the trade name Comirnaty. → https://is.gd/ANjMBt | 16:07 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Serbia: +1837 cases (now 744150), +4 deaths (now 7218), +12091 tests (now 4.9 million) since 23 hours ago — Iraq: +7151 cases (now 1.8 million), +78 deaths (now 20262), +71292 tests (now 14.0 million) since 22 hours ago — Bangladesh: +5717 cases (now 1.5 million), +117 deaths (now 25399), +36789 tests (now 8.7 million) since 23 hours ago | 16:07 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Norway: +604 cases (now 149212) since 21 hours ago | 16:32 |
| Brainstorm | New from WebMD: FDA: Stop Using Ivermectin Veterinary Drug to Treat COVID: The FDA warns that taking a drug meant for horses and cattle to prevent or treat COVID-19 is dangerous and could be fatal. → https://is.gd/RQwLIN | 16:51 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Cuba: +9320 cases (now 592619), +74 deaths (now 4618), +47223 tests (now 7.5 million) since 22 hours ago | 17:09 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Bosnia and Herz.: +836 cases (now 209909), +18 deaths (now 9740) since 3 days ago | 17:34 |
| lastshell | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xu1FMCxoEFc Understanding & Conquering Depression (not covid link but useful in this times) | 17:38 |
| LjL | archpc, has your roommate eventually tried the oximeter? | 17:52 |
| Brainstorm | New from BioNTech: Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine COMIRNATY® Receives Full U.S. FDA Approval for Individuals 16 Years and Older: COMIRNATY is the first COVID-19 vaccine to be granted FDA approval Approval is based on a comprehensive submission package including six-month efficacy and safety data after second dose More than 1.2 billion [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/UUglQ3 | 17:58 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for United Kingdom: +42790 cases (now 6.5 million), +2170086 tests (now 263.1 million) since 23 hours ago | 17:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from Pfizer: Anonymous: Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine COMIRNATY® Receives Full U.S. FDA Approval for Individuals 16 Years and Older → https://is.gd/UfKc9q | 18:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @EricTopol: R to @EricTopol: Notable also the US tracks much more closely with Israel for hospitalizations than UK.This raises the question of the mRNA vaccine and its short-spacing (3 weeks, Pfizer) as the common thread. → https://is.gd/GMwcZG | 18:31 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Chile: +578 cases (now 1.6 million), +38 deaths (now 36688), +51960 tests (now 19.9 million) since a day ago | 18:36 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: NYC Mandates Vaccinations for Public School Teachers, Staff → https://is.gd/QNRI6N | 19:26 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Italy: +4166 cases (now 4.5 million), +44 deaths (now 128795) since a day ago — Moldova: +314 cases (now 264746), +6 deaths (now 6369), +3979 tests (now 1.5 million) since a day ago | 19:39 |
| -RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Zotero / COVID links Group / Top-Level Items: Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine COMIRNATY® Receives Full U.S. FDA Approval for Individuals 16 Years and Older | BioNTech ( https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/U3EHJ59I ) | 20:08 | |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @EricTopol: This is just the beginning of what happens when the @US_FDA grants full approval to the vaccine → https://is.gd/JOK4pL | 20:21 |
| LjL | does he even agree with it? (Eric Topol) i seem to remember reading he was against mandates | 20:29 |
| twomoon | i guess this is the same as a back-to-the-office mandate | 20:31 |
| twomoon | back-to-school, back-to-the-office | 20:32 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Jamaica: +879 cases (now 62712), +14 deaths (now 1402), +2710 tests (now 533840) since a day ago — Luxembourg: +145 cases (now 75130) since 3 days ago — Turkey: +12493 cases (now 6.2 million), +282528 tests (now 74.1 million) since 16 hours ago — Singapore: +98 cases (now 66576), +1 deaths (now 50) since a day ago | 20:41 |
| specing | back to the future | 20:41 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Cuban doctors voice rare criticism of government's Covid-19 handling → https://is.gd/0QTWYM | 20:43 |
| LjL | specing, watched that the other day | 20:54 |
| IndoAnon | LjL: do you mind if I make a mini-census? | 20:58 |
| LjL | IndoAnon, meaning? | 20:58 |
| IndoAnon | Well, I won't ask about their mental health, but rather about their view regarding pathogen and mitigations | 21:01 |
| LjL | them who | 21:01 |
| IndoAnon | Well, I hope you and people on this channel | 21:02 |
| LjL | IndoAnon, if you're going to PM or highlight every person in here... that's going to be considered inappropriate by many, i wager | 21:03 |
| LjL | if you want to post a poll, sure, but don't expect many replies i think | 21:03 |
| IndoAnon | LjL, I am too lazy to make that kind of stuff. | 21:05 |
| IndoAnon | I would figure out the foss alternative to google forms, then I would share the link | 21:05 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Morocco: +2996 cases (now 813945), +97 deaths (now 11889), +18510 tests (now 8.7 million) since a day ago — Greenland: +7 cases (now 305), +1049 tests (now 55170) since 2 days ago | 21:06 |
| IndoAnon | *will | 21:06 |
| LjL | IndoAnon, fine with me | 21:10 |
| IndoAnon | >Open Source Apps with 'online-survey' feature>Sorry, we didn't find any apps with these filters. | 21:14 |
| IndoAnon | Ugh | 21:14 |
| Brainstorm | New from CIDRAP: News Scan for Aug 23, 2021: Breakthrough COVID-19 infectivity Youth perceptions of COVID vaccines Another Chinese H5N6 avian flu case → https://is.gd/toaWba | 21:15 |
| IndoAnon | Maybe I will use https://ec.europa.eu/eusurvey/ this instead | 21:17 |
| LjL | creepy | 21:23 |
| LjL | use something not run by my government :P | 21:23 |
| LjL | there are open source survey apps if you can self-host them | 21:24 |
| LjL | (maybe also if you can't, but that's what i found so far) | 21:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @EricTopol: R to @EricTopol: Additional graph via @jburnmurdoch regarding his piece with @MehulAtLarge @FT, top post of threadTracking of severe disease and cases in Israel as time elapsed from vaccination, age > 60From long, very good 🧵here → https://is.gd/9tAQFm | 21:26 |
| LjL | IndoAnon, https://www.limesurvey.org/pricing there is a free tier on this one but it allows 25 responses per month, lol | 21:28 |
| LjL | although to be fair i'm not sure you'll get 25 responses in a month :P | 21:29 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for South Africa: +7632 cases (now 2.7 million), +163 deaths (now 79584), +37789 tests (now 16.0 million) since a day ago — Kenya: +619 cases (now 229628), +31 deaths (now 4528), +4647 tests (now 2.3 million) since a day ago — North Macedonia: +330 cases (now 169202), +27 deaths (now 5695), +3022 tests (now 1.1 million) since 23 hours ago [... want %more?] | 21:30 |
| specing | IndoAnon: framadate | 21:35 |
| LjL | why did that not even show in the first like ten hits of "open source survey" ;( | 21:37 |
| LjL | i guess because it's not its primary purpose, but still | 21:37 |
| IndoAnon | Yea, what a shame | 21:38 |
| IndoAnon | >25 | 21:38 |
| specing | if you are fine with proprietary then I guess you can also use 1ka.si | 21:41 |
| de-facto | hmm what about that AY.3 Delta sublineage? | 21:41 |
| specing | it's very popular in my country | 21:41 |
| de-facto | seems to take over the US https://outbreak.info/situation-reports?pango=AY.3&loc=USA&selected=USA | 21:42 |
| de-facto | e.g. seems to be more reproductive than B.1.617.2 in USA | 21:42 |
| de-facto | in Germany it also seems to slowly increase against B.1.617.2 | 21:43 |
| LjL | de-facto, that would be bad news iirc because it's considered more vaccine-evading | 21:43 |
| LjL | not entirely sure | 21:43 |
| tototo | show me your green pass | 21:44 |
| LjL | no | 21:45 |
| tototo | you don't have one? | 21:45 |
| LjL | i do, i'm just not meant to show it to random people so they can resell it on telegram | 21:45 |
| tototo | good reasoning | 21:46 |
| tototo | do people take a picture of it and show it on insta? | 21:46 |
| de-facto | .title https://imgur.com/a/Z4QFagx https://i.imgur.com/5zdtwxN.png src: https://www.rki.de/DE/Content/InfAZ/N/Neuartiges_Coronavirus/Situationsberichte/Wochenbericht/Wochenbericht_2021-08-19.pdf?__blob=publicationFile | 21:46 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From imgur.com: COVID Germany: SARS-CoV-2 VoC Evolution - Album on Imgur | 21:46 |
| specing | isnt it useless without ID? | 21:46 |
| LjL | specing, unfortunately not in practice | 21:49 |
| LjL | most establishment in Italy don't check it against the ID unless the data on it (gender/age) are obviously inconsistent with the person | 21:49 |
| LjL | and the politicians made enough of a mess about it that they actually sent out a memo *allowing* that | 21:49 |
| de-facto | idk i dont like that AY.3 development, we should keep an eye on that | 21:49 |
| Timvde | LjL: In theory it's only valid with an id | 21:51 |
| Timvde | Oh, nvm, specing already said that :p | 21:51 |
| LjL | Timvde, that's the EU theory, it's not the Italian theory apparently, and in practice i expect ID won't be routinely checked in other countries as well (i.e. they will when like boarding an airplane, but much less likely when entering a pub) | 21:52 |
| LjL | plus faking a valid certificate is hard, faking an ID can be easy depending on specifics | 21:52 |
| LjL | de-facto, <nixonix> but: people who had received Covaxin developed 23% lower levels of antibodies against delta variant infections (compared to infections of the B.1 strain); 33% lower against AY.1 and nearly 47% lower against AY.3 | 21:56 |
| LjL | %title https://nitter.eu/chrischirp/status/1428062171024568325 de-facto | 21:57 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: From nitter.eu: Prof. Christina Pagel (@chrischirp): "UPDATE: apparently the classification of sequences into the different AY. sub lineages of Delta is very fluid at the moment and has in fact changed in just in the [...] | 21:57 |
| nixonix | i saw that, but were the same exact set of selected neut abs compared to all those variants? if not, may be just variance | 21:58 |
| LjL | nixonix, see the tweet also... looks like a classification mess | 21:59 |
| nixonix | ay.3 didnt seem that different, one mutation in orf1a mostly, then one in S that had a bit different prercentages. I371V and G142D | 22:01 |
| de-facto | Difference B.1.617.2 to AY.3 sublineage according to outbreak.info +ORF1a A1306S; +ORF1a P2046L; +ORF1a P2287S; +ORF1a V2930L; +ORF1a T3255I; +ORF1a T3646A; +ORF1a I3731V; +ORF1b A1918V; -S G142D; +ORF7b T40I; +N G215C | 22:02 |
| nixonix | percentages for most of them dont differ much | 22:03 |
| de-facto | so according to that there is only one difference in s-protein: -S G142D | 22:03 |
| de-facto | + meaning its an addition, - meaning its missing in AY.3 compared to B.1.617.2 | 22:04 |
| LjL | if that tweet is true though, they might have changed what mutations are considered part of it recently... | 22:04 |
| LjL | which i don't know why they would do that, liking confusion? | 22:04 |
| de-facto | i wonder what that big cluster of mutations in ORF1a means | 22:04 |
| de-facto | its in the open reading frame, hence should be mapped on the specific proteins | 22:05 |
| LjL | i don't understand this graph here https://outbreak.info/location-reports?loc=ITA&selected=AY.1&selected=AY.2&selected=AY.3&selected=AY.3.1 | 22:06 |
| LjL | it auto-selected only those variants for me apparently, which makes sense since Delta is almost all there is i guess? but then i don't understand what i'm looking at | 22:06 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/BallouxFrancois/status/1428035296076107779 | 22:07 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Prof Francois Balloux (@BallouxFrancois): "AY.3 is delta (B.1.167.2) with a mutation in the ORF1A gene (I3731V). Given that every SARS-CoV-2 lineage accumulates ~1-2 mutations a month, and that I3731V [...] | 22:07 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Barbados: +12 cases (now 4652), +1672 tests (now 248865) since a day ago | 22:08 |
| de-facto | .title https://imgur.com/a/OsJWpgA https://i.imgur.com/3npBXjm.png https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0022283620306422 | 22:13 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From imgur.com: Genome organization of the SARS-CoV-2 - Album on Imgur | 22:13 |
| nixonix | google doesnt find more recent tweets on ay.3 from balloux, so its prob nothing. unless it really starts to spread, but i doubt. small number of samples, maybe more from some clusters, a bit founders effect. and add that mess with classification | 22:15 |
| de-facto | +ORF1a A1306S (NSP3); +ORF1a P2046L (NSP3); +ORF1a P2287S (NSP3); +ORF1a V2930L (NSP4); +ORF1a T3255I (NSP4); +ORF1a T3646A (NSP6); +ORF1a I3731V (NSP6); +ORF1b A1918V (NSP3) | 22:16 |
| de-facto | hmm i wonder if that outbreak,info data is accurate | 22:17 |
| de-facto | why would B.1.617.2 not have a single mutation in ORF1a | 22:18 |
| de-facto | i find that highly unlikely | 22:18 |
| de-facto | it probably is just incomplete or not well defined for Delta or such | 22:18 |
| de-facto | do we have a better source for specific differences between Delta and AY.3 ? | 22:19 |
| nixonix | do many variants have? some of them are conserved. then there are sometimes those deletions | 22:19 |
| nixonix | the best source is the experts whose field it is. like balloux | 22:21 |
| Brainstorm | New from CIDRAP: Pfizer COVID vaccine gains full FDA approval: Stephanie Soucheray | News Reporter | CIDRAP News Aug 23, 2021 Full approval allows more businesses, schools, and organizations to mandate vaccine use among employees and students. → https://is.gd/PhzDjJ | 22:23 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1429870080041492482 | 22:23 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): "This is just the beginning of what happens when the @US_FDA grants full approval to the vaccine" | 42l - nitter | 22:23 |
| nixonix | mandatory vax in italy for those over 50 or 40? how are they going to enforce it? police holding the customers and nurses jabbing? or giving ticket for those refusing? | 22:24 |
| nixonix | thats why those cruel incentives are way better | 22:25 |
| de-facto | AY.3 increasing in UK too https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E9FNcy0XMAwwGdJ?format=jpg&name=medium | 22:27 |
| Timvde | Here we are mandating it for people working in healthcare | 22:28 |
| de-facto | https://twitter.com/chrischirp/status/1428014796897652737 | 22:28 |
| de-facto | also in US ofc https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E9FN4ayWYAI-Ktf?format=jpg&name=medium | 22:29 |
| nixonix | balloux: Actually not much AY.3 in the UK either. A fraction of the putative UK AY.3 seem to have been misassigned. The within delta sub-clade is a bit of a mess. | 22:30 |
| nixonix | yeah, for hc, army and stuff. but thats different than for population or those over some age | 22:31 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Mauritius: +1028 cases (now 8098), +3 deaths (now 25) since 3 days ago — Spain: +23899 cases (now 4.8 million), +201 deaths (now 83337) since 2 days ago | 22:33 |
| de-facto | "TLDR: Definitely the first clear sign of potentially worrying variant here in a while." | 22:33 |
| de-facto | .title https://twitter.com/chrischirp/status/1428014779768180738 | 22:33 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto, the URL could not be loaded | 22:33 |
| nixonix | if you have sites showing cases by age-group for countries where schools have already started, please link | 22:34 |
| nixonix | they have started in several scandinavian countries (i have age group links for finland if interested), scotland, and some regions in usa | 22:35 |
| de-facto | https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/?ACSTrackingID=USCDC_2146-DM60904&ACSTrackingLabel=Laboratory%20Advisory%3A%20SARS-CoV-2%20Variants%20AY.1%20and%20AY.2%20Now%20Aggregated%20with%20Delta%20Variant%20B.1.617.2&deliveryName=USCDC_2146-DM60904#variant-proportions | 22:35 |
| nixonix | but mostly in usa they start end of august or early sep | 22:35 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.travellingtabby.com/scotland-coronavirus-tracker/ | 22:35 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.travellingtabby.com: Scotland Coronavirus Tracker | 22:35 |
| nixonix | it also has vaccinations by age group. but they just recently started 16-17 yo | 22:36 |
| nixonix | cases going up in all age groups. doesnt prove school infections would be issue there, yet anyway. if testing and tracing is the same (not sure when they reopened) | 22:38 |
| Timvde | nixonix: 100% of 60+? Is it mandatory? | 22:39 |
| nixonix | probably not, hmm. there are those old and fragile who it's not usually given. cant be 100% for all of those | 22:42 |
| nixonix | here share of <10 yo has over doubled since mid july. but its stready increase, so schools cant be affecting most of it. they have been open 2 weeks (some just a week) | 22:43 |
| nixonix | increase might be from day care centers then. and will probably hit schools during the next couple weeks, especially when more lapse quarantines, not whole classes etc, seems to be happening | 22:44 |
| nixonix | those above meant finland | 22:45 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1429878202437144577 | 22:46 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: John Burn-Murdoch (@jburnmurdoch): "Could it be that, within each age group, the first to be vaccinated were more likely to have underlying conditions? Perhaps they were healthcare workers who are [...] | 22:46 |
| nixonix | i dont like this, since the delay is in practice way longer than 6 and 14 days for hospitalization and death (first mostly young ppl are driver of case increase, then they infect older folks, and the oldest come even later): | 22:50 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1429793104698253316 | 22:50 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Paul Mainwood (@PaulMainwood): "Absolutely love the triple-scale chart @TravellingTabby implemented for Scotland here: https://www.travellingtabby.com/scotland-coronavirus-tracker/ so I thought I'd [...] | 22:50 |
| nixonix | for deaths the delay was 4-8 weeks last fall, depending on country. vaccinations and some other factors might have changed it a bit, though | 22:51 |
| nixonix | in europe the above delay | 22:52 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID19 Vaccine Tracker: Andy Becker: Baiya Phytopharm Co Ltd: Baiya SARS-CoV-2 Vax 1 Vaccine → https://is.gd/bs21km | 22:55 |
| nixonix | then those graphs topol had today, showing cases, hospitalizations and deaths, comparing if the vaccinations have "broken the link", and if the waning has affected. hospitalizations are prob 100% identified, deaths often not (comparing to excess mortality), and cases even less often - and for the latter it depends the situation. more cases hidden | 22:56 |
| nixonix | when its spiking | 22:56 |
| LjL | <nixonix> mandatory vax in italy for those over 50 or 40? ← wut? | 22:56 |
| nixonix | ill find the finnish article... | 22:57 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.verkkouutiset.fi/italiassa-valaytetaan-koronan-rokotuspakkoa/ | 22:57 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.verkkouutiset.fi: Italiassa väläytetään koronan rokotuspakkoa – verkkouutiset.fi | 22:57 |
| nixonix | dont use translator, just do it! | 22:57 |
| nixonix | still not believing az waning that much slower. its way within confidence intervals, that it actually wanes much faster than pfizer! | 23:01 |
| nixonix | jpost is like daily mail. it has often interesting stuff, but just dont believe any of it unless checked from other sources | 23:03 |
| nixonix | their recent articles on exo-cd24 and ivermectin, sigh | 23:03 |
| LjL | i'm afraid without translator i understand it's about italy, coronavirus, la stampa, something 40 and 50, and that's it :P | 23:04 |
| ecks | "If we haven | 23:06 |
| ecks | 't reached by Sep 15 80% vaccine coverage, we will have to consider a potential mandatory vaccination" | 23:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID19 Vaccine Tracker: Andy Becker: Bagheiat-allah University of Medical Sciences: COVID-19 Recombinant RBD Protein Vaccine → https://is.gd/7u1GtD | 23:06 |
| ecks | Some have talked about 50+, but I would protect all 40+" | 23:06 |
| LjL | yes, well, the same person who said that also said this | 23:07 |
| LjL | %tr <it La terza dose di vaccino sarà necessaria? "Se vedremo un aumento dei casi tra chi si era vaccinato, perché la copertura dell'immunizzazione è scesa con il passare dei mesi - risponde -, si dovrà fare una terza dose. Ma aspettiamo di leggere dati e numeri" | 23:07 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, Italian to English: Will the third dose of the vaccine be necessary? "If we see an increase in cases among those who had been vaccinated, because the coverage of immunization has dropped over the months - he replies -, a third dose will have to be taken. But let's wait to read data and numbers" (MyMemory, Google) | 23:07 |
| LjL | anyway he also said he thinks making it mandatory won't be necessary because the trend shows we should reach 80% by that time | 23:08 |
| LjL | %tr <it La vaccinazione va molto bene e arriveremo all'80% auspicato. Ma lasciamo aperta la possibilità per alcune categorie, per alcune fasce d'età di una forma di spinta alla vaccinazione nel caso che non si raggiunga quella percentuale. Non credo che servirà con il trend che abbiamo. | 23:08 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, Italian to English: Vaccination is going very well and we will reach the desired 80%. But we leave open the possibility for some categories, for some age groups of a form of boost to vaccination in case that percentage is not reached. I don't think it will work with the trend we have. (MyMemory, Google) | 23:08 |
| LjL | i like that they keep saying the hospitalized are "mostly" not vaccinated but they never say the actual percentages | 23:09 |
| lastshell | yeah, we need more real numbers ^ | 23:16 |
| vulpes[m] | Hey hi | 23:17 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @EricTopol: When is another pandemic as extreme as Covid-19 likely to occur?https://www.pnas.org/content/118/35/e2105482118 @PNASNews @DukeU @parolari → https://is.gd/wgP7Yz | 23:17 |
| vulpes[m] | Anyone else speak spanish? | 23:17 |
| LjL | a lot of people, but i think i'd prefer to keep this channel in english :P | 23:18 |
| vulpes[m] | That's nice, np | 23:20 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.14.21262020v1 | 23:22 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.medrxiv.org: Delta variant and mRNA Covid-19 vaccines effectiveness: higher odds of vaccine infection breakthroughs | medRxiv | 23:22 |
| LjL | nixonix, "Individuals infected with the Delta variant were more frequently vaccinated 162 (12%) than individuals infected with the Alpha variant 38 (5%)." definitely low percentages in both cases though. but it was done between may and july... | 23:29 |
| LjL | "We report a statistically significant higher odds of vaccine infection breakthrough for partial (OR=1.70; CI95% 1.18 to 2.47) and complete vaccination (OR=1.96; CI95% 1.22 to 3.14) in the Delta cases when compared to the Alpha cases" ← unless i misunderstand the numbers, wouldn't this show full vaccine is, relatively, *less* effective than partial vaccine? (although the CIs are so wide) | 23:30 |
| pwr22 | re: polls <- could probably run some sort of irc or matrix bot | 23:30 |
| rpifan | how likely is to get reinfect from covid | 23:31 |
| rpifan | i think ive got a fever again and a sore throat | 23:31 |
| nixonix | yeah, and the difference was the smallest when <14d from the first. it just shows the increasing protection, when abs and cellular immunity develops, is a shallower curve against delta | 23:32 |
| LjL | rpifan, so soon? i'd probably assume you're having rebound symptoms rather than being reinfected | 23:32 |
| LjL | which does happen unfortunately | 23:32 |
| LjL | how high fever? | 23:32 |
| nixonix | *cell-mediated | 23:33 |
| -RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Zotero / COVID links Group / Top-Level Items: Delta variant and mRNA Covid-19 vaccines effectiveness: higher odds of vaccine infection breakthroughs ( https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/4ZSCZ4VI ) | 23:33 | |
| rpifan | i dont have a thermometer | 23:33 |
| rpifan | but i was so cold all day and then i took a tylenol | 23:33 |
| rpifan | and now im warm | 23:33 |
| LjL | nixonix, right, it makes sense, but when they were first looking at vaccines vs Delta, it seemed that there was a particular unbalance between 1 dose (very little protection) and 2 doses (decent protection again, not as good as before, but decent). which is why the UK changed the spacing to 8 weeks from 12 | 23:34 |
| LjL | rpifan, you've already had covid and you still don't have a thermometer and/or a pulse oximeter... i dunno what to say | 23:34 |
| archpc | hi LjL | 23:34 |
| LjL | hey archpc how are you? | 23:34 |
| LjL | vulpes[m] didn't like english i guess | 23:35 |
| nixonix | or they could have changed it from early data showing 8 weeks or so would create similar protection than 12 (in the paper posted here couple of days ago) | 23:35 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Canada: +660 cases (now 1.5 million) since 20 hours ago | 23:35 |
| archpc | pretty shit | 23:35 |
| rpifan | ive only just settled back down in beerelin | 23:35 |
| nixonix | and they had more age groups vaccinated, so they could shorten the interval. also cases were increasing, so more ppl had some protection faster | 23:36 |
| LjL | archpc, has your roommate or someone double-checked that oximeter? | 23:36 |
| nixonix | forget the last one, it was the opposite effect... | 23:36 |
| LjL | nixonix, but they were explicitly doing it due to the protection against Delta, iirc from UK reports | 23:36 |
| archpc | yeah, hers was in the mid 99s | 23:36 |
| archpc | 90*s | 23:37 |
| rpifan | rebound symptoms? | 23:37 |
| rpifan | well i had a quick test on saturday | 23:37 |
| rpifan | and it was negative | 23:37 |
| nixonix | but those needing good protection got it faster when shortened, when there was less lack of doses | 23:37 |
| LjL | rpifan, doesn't matter whether you're positive or negative, people who have longer-lasting symptoms often have a period of feeling better and then worse again | 23:37 |
| rpifan | well the paracetamol made a huge difference | 23:38 |
| LjL | archpc, bit uneasy to mention this, but it has been pointed out to me, pulse oximeters tend to only work reliably on white people, fyi | 23:38 |
| nixonix | yeah, maybe it was the most important reason. they considered it here too, and then reduced it to 8 (before that they thought if 3-4 weeks would have been better, because immune evasion properties of it) | 23:38 |
| LjL | rpifan, maybe it's just a bad day, but if it continues, you probably can't just continue taking paracetamols | 23:38 |
| archpc | LjL, I'm white as can be | 23:39 |
| LjL | archpc, okay, well that's not good for you in this case :P | 23:39 |
| nixonix | i thought 3-4 weeks should have been kept, so the old and hc personnels would have got protection faster, and when it looked like SA variant would take over. and because better killer t-cell response | 23:39 |
| LjL | archpc, is yours still 83% or so? | 23:39 |
| rpifan | well ill go get a thermometer tommorow | 23:39 |
| nixonix | but now with new information, if longer intervals has more lasting protection, maybe it was better after all. but 6-8 weeks would be better as a default imo (not sure whats the default now here, it might depend on region) | 23:40 |
| LjL | nixonix, a lot of complex factors to decide on | 23:40 |
| archpc | It's 83 as of 5:30 | 23:40 |
| dTal | archpc, what are your options for medical care? | 23:41 |
| archpc | Driving to Charlotte | 23:41 |
| dTal | Can your roommate drive you there? How far is it? | 23:41 |
| archpc | or camping in my car in a hospital parking lot and fending off the tweakers trying to get my catalytic converter | 23:42 |
| LjL | rpifan, and a pulse oximeter i would recommend. take archpc, even though he's still not going to hospital, being able to tell hospitals/doctors/whoever he calls that he has 83% oxigen saturation is an important thing for them to know, it can make the difference between "stay home and take care" and "we'll send an ambulance" | 23:42 |
| rpifan | thats a good point | 23:43 |
| archpc | It's about 2 hours I think | 23:43 |
| nixonix | reading of less than 92% might increase the need for hospitalization | 23:43 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/treating-covid-19-at-home/art-20483273 | 23:44 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.mayoclinic.org: Treating COVID-19 at home: Care tips for you and others - Mayo Clinic | 23:44 |
| nixonix | it that reading is accurate, risk of brain damage as i understand. ecks ? | 23:44 |
| dTal | NHS guidelines say if blood oxygen level is 92% or less, that's a trip to the ER | 23:45 |
| darsie | I had SpO2 below the detection limit. | 23:46 |
| ecks | we generally draw the line at 92% yes | 23:47 |
| nixonix | what should he do, his oximeter is cvs health el cheapo meter? call doctor obv` | 23:48 |
| LjL | but now he checked it with someone else and they read in the mid-90%s | 23:49 |
| LjL | so the oximeter is not reading 83% just because it's bad | 23:49 |
| dTal | archpc, pale skin is another bad sign | 23:49 |
| archpc | my skins fine, just sweaty | 23:50 |
| dTal | ah, I misread your "white as can be" remark | 23:51 |
| LjL | darsie, i don't remember, did you go to hospital? | 23:51 |
| darsie | LjL: Emergency docs came and rescued me, then hospital. | 23:51 |
| darsie | accidental drug overdose | 23:52 |
| LjL | darsie, sorry if i forgot | 23:52 |
| LjL | oh | 23:52 |
| nixonix | i read above, that for room mate it showed mid 90s. so 83, if used properly and similarly with the room mate, its hospital trip imo | 23:53 |
| darsie | I have two cheap oximeters and they are very different. | 23:53 |
| darsie | I trust the more sensitive one more. | 23:54 |
| LjL | i have two and they can be different too, but they are generally "compatible" if i wait long enough. on the short term, they can have different readings | 23:54 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/itosettiMD_MBA/status/1421505803178201088 | 23:55 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Irene Tosetti (@itosettiMD_MBA): "If it shows anything under 92% get checked immediately. I suggest following these clear recommendations https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in- [...] | 23:55 |
| ecks | when the pandemic has been going on for five years, i'm sure everyone will have poc arterial blood gas at home | 23:56 |
| LjL | ecks, are you? people still don't have thermometers... :P | 23:57 |
| ecks | hell i didn't have one until recently | 23:57 |
| ecks | took my temperature once and it was a disappointing 37.2 | 23:57 |
| LjL | for me that's a sign i'm not well already | 23:58 |
| nixonix | we lost the good mercury one. its somewhere... | 23:58 |
| LjL | nixonix, on the floor, broken? | 23:58 |
| LjL | the electronic ones aren't that bad anyway. just ignore their beeps | 23:58 |
| nixonix | no, just somewhere. probably put safe so it doesnt break | 23:58 |
| LjL | most of them beep way before reaching temperature | 23:58 |
| ecks | I'm not batting an eyelid before 38.0 | 23:59 |
| LjL | ecks, dry eyes can cause complications | 23:59 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.17.0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at https://mg.pov.lt/irclog2html/!
