gnu_srs | Beerbelott: And with policykit-1-gnome installed you can even use synaptic from the menu :) | 00:02 |
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gnu_srs | Hi, did you see that a new version of sysvinit is available: 2.90? | 00:24 |
ChuangTzu | https://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/sysvinit-devel/2018-06/msg00011.html | 00:35 |
SuicideJunkie | Well, good news for me, got the phone updated to Marshmallow and unbricked, so life is good again. | 01:32 |
refracta_noob | I really want the Purism phone. I'd like to get refracta on it of course. | 01:36 |
mmlj4 | howdy, doodies | 04:45 |
tinkering | Can you use systemd with Devuan? | 05:13 |
j9m | you've come to the wrong hood | 05:24 |
Criggie | tinkering: are you trolling? cos you're not doing it very well. | 05:33 |
gnarface | tinkering: the answer is no. see the list of banned packages: http://deb.devuan.org/bannedpackages.txt | 05:43 |
gnarface | tinkering: the reason is technical. if they could have included systemd, simply as a non-default option, they would have. | 05:43 |
gnarface | some packages that were not removed still have limited functionality | 05:45 |
gnarface | (where pre-systemd hooks had been removed from their code) | 05:46 |
gnarface | none of that is really by devuan's choice | 05:46 |
gnarface | every effort has been made to go back to the basic expected behavior of the system from before systemd tried to strategically disallow other init options | 05:47 |
gnarface | (and temperature, and session management and logging and...) | 05:47 |
gnarface | and for the vast majority of packages it has been a success | 05:47 |
gnarface | try the livecd and if there's something you're missing, ask about alternatives other people are using | 05:48 |
gnarface | it didn't break any of my stuff, for whatever it's worth | 05:49 |
gnarface | (debian jessie did, however, as did raspbian jessie) | 05:49 |
gnarface | (whatever their equivalent to jessie was) | 05:50 |
gnarface | oh, yea they did call it jessie | 05:50 |
gnarface | anyway, yea. systemd breaks a lot of stuff that it's even related to by the second or third degree | 05:50 |
gnarface | tinkering: it's also probably worth mentioning that a devuan install with systemd running would be by definition functionally identical to debian... and thereby an entirely redundant waste of time | 06:03 |
gnarface | tinkering: so if you were really asking the question as some sort of attempt to litmus test the project for hypocrisy before trying it out, rest assured we'll be happy to help, but everyone here right now is expecting you to just troll out | 06:05 |
gnarface | (*I've* seen 2 other people make the same mistake before and end up converting, so I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt for now) | 06:06 |
tinkering | Now I feel bad for asking. :( | 06:26 |
gnarface | tinkering: if you've got a spare USB key, try out the live image :) maybe you'll like it, maybe you won't | 06:28 |
gnarface | you'll notice differences but not many | 06:29 |
gnarface | the distro exists primarily for people who experienced unacceptable regressions or behavioral changes with systemd | 06:32 |
gnarface | if you had no complaints about systemd then there's no way to know what you'll prefer | 06:33 |
tinkering | I'll probably try it. I don't like systemd that much. It's hard to remember what the names of services are and stuff. | 06:37 |
TheBlueWizard | what's the password for "devuan" account in Devuan Live DVD distro? thanks! | 06:50 |
gnarface | isn't it just also 'devuan'? | 06:51 |
gnarface | the root password is "toor" - i remember that much | 06:52 |
gnarface | you can reset either password knowing that | 06:53 |
Jjp137 | yea it's just 'devuan' (see: https://files.devuan.org/devuan_ascii/desktop-live/README.txt) | 06:53 |
TheBlueWizard | when I tried out the "lock screen", I then yried to get back in, and in doing so I see the login window showing "devuan". I tried several passwords including blank...nothing works. I was forced to power cycle the box heh | 06:54 |
TheBlueWizard | I see re README.txt...gonna try that now ha ha! | 06:55 |
TheBlueWizard | OK it works! thanks! gonna go to bed now.... | 06:56 |
gnarface | np, peace | 06:56 |
* TheBlueWizard notes that while the screen is locked, the ctrl-alt-del keystrokes is completely ignored | 06:57 | |
refracta_noob | bday coming up in July, I'm going to get myself a Devuan hoodie and celebrate 19 years of Linux. | 06:57 |
gnarface | TheBlueWizard: yea, that's off by default now for security. i believe it can still be re-enabled manually | 06:57 |
gnarface | i think the disabling of the "ctrl+alt+backspace" control sequence by default in Xorg is a change that predates devuan and systemd | 07:16 |
pandu | hello all, I want to install devuan on my laptop compaq presario CQ42 (the LCD is broken, and I connect it to my sony LED via HDMI) and after boot message it only show abstrak grey display (no desktop). I'm using USB with DD command, and use XFCE live iso. any sugestions? | 07:20 |
holla | pandu: resolution issue maybe? could you ssh in your broken laptop to run xrand? | 07:22 |
gnarface | pandu: yea should be fixable by running xrandr, but this might be difficult without changing some config stuff manually remotely if you can't see the first screen | 07:24 |
gnarface | pandu: lots of laptops though, have a trick where you can make the external monitor connector recognized as the first/default screen if you boot it up with the lid closed and a keyboard plugged in | 07:24 |
gnarface | pandu: might be worth a try (check your laptop manual) | 07:25 |
holla | or some Fn key combo | 07:25 |
gnarface | yea, there may be hints silkscreened on the keys in blue or something like that | 07:25 |
pandu | holla: it's happen in many distro (all manjaro, peppermint, arcolinux, bunsenlabs, etc) only few that success (opensuse, gecko, mint, mxlinux). | 07:25 |
holla | wow, you surely did some extensive testing there ;) | 07:26 |
gnarface | pandu: the distros all have essentially the same software for handling this, so you might have run into bugs but most likely just different defaults | 07:27 |
pandu | yes, because of limited budget here, so I can't buy new LCD for my ten years laptop (it cost almost $100) here :( | 07:27 |
gnarface | pandu: if you can figure out what actually, it should be easy to make that change in devuan | 07:27 |
holla | do you have a second pc or at least a smartphone? | 07:29 |
pandu | yes, I have android phone | 07:29 |
refracta_noob | if you have another computer you could use to run the Refracta Live image on, you could use Refracta tools to install the Live system to another USB which would then be used to install to the laptop | 07:29 |
refracta_noob | (Refracta is Devuan-based) | 07:30 |
holla | does devuan live have sshd started by default? | 07:31 |
holla | if so, you could use connectbot to ssh into your laptop | 07:32 |
pandu | refracta_noob: you mean this? : http://www.ibiblio.org/refracta/ | 07:33 |
pandu | holla: how to do it? | 07:33 |
refracta_noob | http://www.zoyinc.com/?p=2510 - looks like this might work if it's not enabled by default by now | 07:33 |
holla | pandu: install connectbot? the question is whether your devuan runs an sshd - i'm not sure about that | 07:34 |
pandu | holla: I think ssh not run when startup (I check in my devuan in Virtualbox) | 07:43 |
gnarface | i don't think it even starts networking by default | 07:45 |
gnarface | i could be wrong | 07:45 |
refracta_noob | hey fsmithred. | 07:54 |
refracta_noob | any plans to do any Refracta merch? hats/shirts maybe? | 07:55 |
syco_ | hi | 11:42 |
guglicap | trying to debootstrap devuan from arch (using the official debian debootstrap) with this command: 'sudo debootstrap --arch=armhf --foreign --variant=minbase --no-check-gpg oldstable /mnt http://deb.devuan.org/merged' | 12:25 |
guglicap | it almost works except for some packages like Couldn't download package libc6 (ver 2.19-18+deb8u10 arch armhf) at http://deb.devuan.org/merged/pool/DEBIAN/main/g/glibc/libc6_2.19-18+deb8u10_armhf.deb | 12:26 |
guglicap | anyone knows how to fix this? thanks | 12:26 |
gnarface | guglicap: possibly the debian one is still broken | 12:27 |
guglicap | actually it came to mind as I was writing that to use "jessie" instead of oldstable and that works | 12:28 |
gnarface | interesting | 12:28 |
guglicap | but I can't use "ascii" as the official debootstrap doesn't recognize it as a suite name and thinks it's an install script | 12:29 |
gnarface | heh | 12:29 |
gnarface | bummer | 12:29 |
guglicap | there must be a way around it tho | 12:29 |
gnarface | i can think of a few | 12:29 |
gnarface | i vaguely recall someone may have mentioned editing a single file to add ascii to it | 12:30 |
gnarface | if all else fails though you can just install the devuan debootstrap and that should work from debian | 12:31 |
guglicap | oh it's cool | 12:31 |
guglicap | so if you list the files owned by the "debootstrap" package it turns out that in /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts there are a bunch of scripts for each release | 12:32 |
gnarface | hmm | 12:33 |
guglicap | like /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/stretch points to /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/sid | 12:33 |
gnarface | hmmm | 12:33 |
gnarface | same here | 12:33 |
guglicap | so you can just run it like debootstrap ascii /mnt <mirror> /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/sid | 12:34 |
gnarface | on my install here, ascii points to ceres though, not sid | 12:34 |
guglicap | huh | 12:34 |
gnarface | but i'm on ceres, not ascii | 12:34 |
gnarface | ceres corresponds to sid | 12:34 |
guglicap | oh | 12:34 |
gnarface | but they're separate scripts in my install | 12:34 |
guglicap | what does the ascii script point to? | 12:35 |
gnarface | i just said, ceres | 12:35 |
guglicap | whoops yeah sorry | 12:35 |
guglicap | can you upload the ceres script to pastebin then? | 12:36 |
gnarface | no, but it appears to be here | 12:38 |
gnarface | https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/debootstrap/blob/a1acc007f5a1de9fae609550f78b836811c1c6cd/scripts/ceres | 12:38 |
gnarface | only about ~40 lines changed i think | 12:40 |
gnarface | it looks derived from the sid one | 12:40 |
guglicap | yeah | 12:43 |
guglicap | that works | 12:43 |
guglicap | thank you! | 12:43 |
gnarface | cool, no problem | 12:44 |
Jay | yo guys | 14:10 |
Jay | is there any info about support/LTS/end-of-life? | 14:10 |
igor80 | hi! congratulations for ascii release! | 14:30 |
igor80 | i realized that my dbus packages where upgraded on march 4th to the debian version 1.10.26-0+deb9u1 | 14:31 |
igor80 | s/where/were/g | 14:31 |
igor80 | now i got back to the devuanised packages and everything is alright | 14:32 |
igor80 | got the same version as the netinst installer 1.10.22-1+devuan1 | 14:32 |
KatolaZ | igor80: are you using othe repos? | 14:32 |
KatolaZ | or only deb.devuan.org? | 14:33 |
igor80 | on march, i don't remember which repo it was (auto, pkgmaster) but now it is deb.devuan | 14:33 |
igor80 | everything is ok now | 14:33 |
KatolaZ | ok | 14:33 |
KatolaZ | please stick with that ;) | 14:33 |
igor80 | i wonder if the dbus packages will be upgraded to the 1.10.26 branch | 14:34 |
igor80 | there may be some other people with debian version of dbus | 14:38 |
KatolaZ | igor80: that would be pretty strange, TBH | 14:38 |
KatolaZ | unless they have used non-Devuan repos | 14:38 |
igor80 | ok as i can't remember precisely what i did on march :-) | 14:39 |
KatolaZ | if we have complaints, we will deal with them :) | 14:39 |
KatolaZ | only solve problems that exist, not those that might exist ;) | 14:39 |
igor80 | so is there a devuanised dbus in sync with 1.10.26 that will pop up? | 14:40 |
KatolaZ | nope | 14:40 |
KatolaZ | I don't think so | 14:40 |
KatolaZ | and if that does not cause problems, there won't be, probably | 14:41 |
igor80 | i understand that dbus is a special case ;-) | 14:41 |
KatolaZ | igor80: if it works, don't touch it | 14:42 |
KatolaZ | :) | 14:42 |
KatolaZ | dbus has all sorts of implications | 14:42 |
KatolaZ | there have not been complaints about how it works in ascii | 14:42 |
KatolaZ | -> don't touch it :) | 14:42 |
igor80 | it worked in both cases but it wasn't really devuan | 14:43 |
igor80 | i came to ascii early | 14:43 |
KatolaZ | igor80: I guess you see what I mean | 14:44 |
igor80 | i suppose | 14:45 |
igor80 | anyway thank you very much | 14:45 |
fsmithred | an upgrade from stretch to ascii would require a downgrade of dbus | 14:45 |
igor80 | oh I've got ascii-proposed-updates in my sources.list and pinned at 500 | 17:43 |
igor80 | that may be the cause of the march upgrade | 17:43 |
igor80 | not sure but ... whatever | 17:44 |
igor80 | just to mention | 17:44 |
igor80 | bye | 17:44 |
Beerbelott | Hello again | 17:53 |
Beerbelott | Following difficulties encountered w/ shutdown/restart from GUI in Devuan Ascii Stable (previsously encountered during beta), I ended up realizing 2 similar packages exist | 17:54 |
Beerbelott | libpolkit-backend-1-0-consolekit & libpolkit-backend-consolekit-1-0 | 17:54 |
Beerbelott | Is there any reason for this? | 17:55 |
KatolaZ | Beerbelott: renaming issues | 17:56 |
Beerbelott | Well I followed https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?pid=8217#p8217 but all I could see on my machine was the correct consolekit packages installed | 18:00 |
Beerbelott | I reinstalled libpolkit-backend-consolekit-1-0 & libpolkit-gobject-consolekit-1-0, since out of any other idea... | 18:00 |
Beerbelott | Shall I switch to elogind? | 18:00 |
Beerbelott | It was working flawlessly before | 18:01 |
KatolaZ | Beerbelott: do you also have elogind installe? | 18:06 |
KatolaZ | ~installed? | 18:06 |
Beerbelott | Nope | 18:11 |
Beerbelott | http://paste.debian.net/hidden/4916489f/ | 18:12 |
Beerbelott | Those are the installed packages | 18:12 |
Beerbelott | Need to go... again | 18:18 |
Beerbelott | KatolaZ: Have u got a copy of the paste? I gonna delete it | 18:19 |
DeFender | I know this is a long shot but does anyone here have any experience getting a twitch stream going with devuan? Specifically, I'm looking for information on what hdmi capture cards, webcams, and microphones will have the least trouble getting them set up and working, and anything else about the software I may need to know. | 19:44 |
refracta_noob | it should be the same as Debian | 19:45 |
NewGnuGuy | DeFender: For hardware compatibility questions in general I recommend you checkout h-node.org | 19:46 |
DeFender | Probably, but since Debian refuses to help Devuan users, I can't ask them... | 19:46 |
jaromil | h-node is distro agnostic | 19:48 |
muep_ | documentation for debian does not care what distro is used by someone who reads the docs | 19:49 |
NewGnuGuy | DeFender: The only discrete webcam I can personally vouch for is the Gear Head Model WC8500HD | 19:50 |
muep_ | but obviously, people spending their time on support on irc often do care | 19:50 |
NewGnuGuy | DeFender: As far as webcams go, any that support UVC ought to work out-of-the-box. | 19:51 |
NewGnuGuy | DeFender: I don't have any experience with hdmi capture cards, unfortunately. | 19:52 |
DeFender | I would imagine that if any UVC webcam would work, that any UVC cap card would work too... | 19:53 |
NewGnuGuy | DeFender: https://h-node.org/webcams/catalogue/en | 19:54 |
refracta_noob | OBS supports nvidia's hardware capture on GTX960/+ cards I think. IDK if that helps at all. | 19:58 |
DeFender | I have a GTX650 and not really looking to upgrade my video card... I'm kinda looking to spend around $100 on a capture card, maybe $20 on a mic and webcam, and otherwise just set up the software | 20:02 |
DeFender | but the info you guys have already given me is much more useful than what I've found previously. Thanks. | 20:03 |
sixwheeledbeast^ | I wouldn't think you would run into any problems with hardware known to work on Linux/Debian and OBS. | 20:03 |
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